[NOTE: This transcript has not undergone a final proofreading and may contain
errors. It is being provided in draft form to enhance access to the video recording. As soon as possible, it will be replaced with a final, corrected transcript and will be synced to the video to provide clickable timecodes.]Anna Takada: 00:00 All right. So if we, you could just start by stating your name.
Gary Hasegawa: 00:05 Uh, my name is Gary Kenji Hasegawa.
AT: 00:09 Okay. And then
GH: 00:09 I'm 76 years old and I've been in Chicago pretty much. Uh, after the
war, pretty much sure. All my life.AT: 00:22 Can you tell me a little bit about where you were born? And,
GH: 00:26 Well, I was born in Puyallup, Washington in 1941. Uh, were on a farm.
My grandparents actually had leased a, the farm and my dad had planned to purchase the farm. And then of course the war broke out and we left. That was pretty much it.AT: 00:54 And so you were, you were very young at the time that the war broke out.
GH: 00:59 Yes. I was, um, Well, 11, 11 months. Wait, let me think. 2040, it was
42. I was born in 41, so around, yeah, about a year. Yeah. A year oldAT: 01:15 And do you know, did you all start at a detention center and then, or,
anything but ..GH: 01:20 Um, yes. Uh, the Puyallup fair grounds, I think it was a temporary
holding points. And then we went to Minidoka, Idaho for the duration.AT: 01:32 And what did your parents do after, or what was the process of leaving camp?
GH: 01:38 Of leaving camp? Well, my dad was sponsored out of Camp. Apparently
that's what was necessary. Uh, so he got an apprenticeship in Rockford as a baker's apprentice. Uh, my parents apparently saved enough money to buy a home, so they did. Uh, my Dad arranged to buy a home in Rockford. Uh, so we were live in Rockford for about three and a half, four years. Uh, then we sold the home. My parents sold the home and we moved to, uh, Chicago. Ummm. My uncle actually owned some businesses in Chicago and my dad, uh, went to work for him and my mom, uh, was a nurse, so she went to work at the University of Chicago, billings as a nurse. Uh,we also, my parents also bought a home, uh, in the Kenwood neighborhood, uh, on Ellis Avenue 44th and Ellis. And uh, I spent actually up to about fifth grade in that location. Uh,AT: 02:57 And what kind of businesses did your uncle own?
GH: 03:01 He had apartment buildings and three restaurants. Uh, so my dad went
to work as a cook in the restaurant, uh.AT: 03:13 Were those also, so those were on the south side?
GH: 03:16 They were all on the south side. Yeah. Everything was on on the south
side. Uh, and I think that was one of the reasons we, we kind of landed up there. I don't know if my parents really have a choice, but that's kind of where we decided to settle.AT: 03:34 And, so since you were, you said you had three siblings?
GH: 03:39 Uh, three brothers, yeah, three brothers. Right. We were very close in
age. Actually. The three of us are 11 months apart. 11 months. 11 months.AT: 03:50 Wow, family lucky number.
GH: 03:51 We were, yeah so, very close in age.
AT: 03:56 And where are you in the birth order?
GH: 03:58 I'm in. Pardon?
AT: 03:59 Where are you in the birth order?
GH: 04:01 I'm in the, I'm second.
AT: 04:02 Okay. Second son?
GH: 04:03 Second eldest. Yeah.
AT: 04:04 So there is, you only had the one, uh, brother who was in camp then?
GH: 04:09 Who was where?
AT: 04:10 Who was in camp?
GH: 04:13 Um, actually one of my brothers was born in the camps. Um, so by the
time we got out, we were all, they were all there, you know, yeah. Actually my brother Aylen interestingly, his name comes from an, from the doctor who actually, um, he agreed to kind of, it was not very fashionable for him to, to help us out, but he did. And so my mom named, uh, my brother Aylen after Dr Aylen.AT: 04:56 Was he a doctor in the camp?
GH: 04:59 Um, no, no. He had to go, he had to come in, you know, and so he kind
of did things that, that were not favorable, you know, what he did and that's why they, my mom really appreciated what he did for us. And so my brother's Aylen a y l e n for Doctor Aylen. Huh.AT: 05:23 And since you were so young in camp,
GH: 05:29 Uh huh
AT: 05:30 Do you have any memories of it or?
GH: 05:32 I might have one vague memory of my grand mother being put on a truck
to go out in the farm fields, but I, I, you know, it could just be my figment of my imagination. But I checked with my mother and she said, yeah, they would load her up on the trucks. And they'd go out to the field, the fields. So I kind of vaguely remember something about it, but I don't know.AT: 05:58 And what about your family, did your parents or did anyone ever talk about?
GH: 06:05 The camps? Uh, not that much. Although, um, my mom would talk about
food rationing or trying to do something with food. It'll getting us more food. Uh, also something with, uh, medical care cause she was a nurse. Um, there were some shortages and that sort of thing.AT: 06:35 Did she ..
GH: 06:35 Dealing with that kind of thing, yeah.
AT: 06:37 Did she work as a nurse in camp?
GH: 06:39 Yes. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. She had a nursing degree at that time. And, uh,
yeah. Although it was difficult for her to even achieve that, I mean, there was a lot of, you know, she, she was a very bright woman, but, uh, she said it was very difficult to get into nursing school and that sort of thing being Japanese.AT: 07:02 Oh?
GH: 07:02 Yeah.
AT: 07:08 And so I'm, I'm just thinking about, you know, being so, so young or
having that experience happen at such an early part of your life. Um, I mean, was it something that you always knew about that you were, you know, your family was in camp?GH: 07:35 Although my mom was a very strong, uh, not typically Japanese
[excuse?], But uh...AT: 07:46 And...
GH: 07:46 and then she was involved with the redress and everything. You know
what I mean? She really was. Uh, but there was, I nurse a lot of feelings about it and, uh, but it's not like they were better. It doesn't mean that the bitterness and resentment and all this sort of thing, it didn't really resonate there. I don't, I don't recall. They just kind of tried to put their life back together. I know that it was difficult and then as again, getting older I appreciate what they went through, but I just sort of a child, you don't really know what's going on or just, you know, that's what it is.AT: 08:38 Hmm. MMM. Was there ever a time in your life when you, um, looked more
into the history of,GH: 08:49 as I got older, I, or I just re appreciated what they went through.
And then of course after the war, I mean there was a lot of pressure to see. I mean, I experienced a lot personally. You know. Um, or at least let's say seven years. I mean, you know, they would call me names and that sort of thing. But, uh,AT: 09:14 Was this, uh, in Chicago or.
GH: 09:17 In Rockford as well as Chicago. Yeah, for sure. And that went on for
awhile. Well.AT: 09:27 Do you remember life in Rockford?
GH: 09:31 Oh Sure. Definitely.
AT: 09:33 Well, what, can you describe it a little bit? What was it?
GH: 09:35 Uh, I wasn't actually in school, but, uh, and we did have, we had
friends, we had a white friends. Uh... It's, um, you know, having my brothers and we were very close in age. We were kind of like a little gang. You know Kip. Kip kept each other company and got into mischief on our own.AT: 10:06 We're there other Japanese Americans?
GH: 10:08 Uh, no, actually not. No, actually when you think of a, I never
thought about it that way, but not really. No. We had, uh, our friends were all white. You know, so, yeah.AT: 10:24 And then how about when you came to Chicago? Can you describe that to me
GH: 10:27 Chicago. We're definitely in a lot of Japanese in Kenwood area or we
moved, uh, we had, uh, the Ellis community center. We were in the boy, cubs scouts, you know, they were a lot of Japanese around. And that's what social, our social activity was with, uh, with the church and with friends.AT: 10:57 Uh which church were you?
GH: 11:00 Kenwood Ellis. It was actually, the church was two doors down on our,
I mean, our home was on Ellis Avenue and then two doors down the church was there. So that was, yeah, it was kind of cool. Very convenient.AT: 11:23 Did you grow up speaking Japanese?
GH: 11:25 No, not at all. See, my, um, um, my parents wanted to assimilate and
they just never spoke Japanese. They, I mean, they knew, they were bilingual, but there's, I mean, they would speak to my grandmother in Japanese. Uh, and then sometimes if they didn't want us to know what was going on, they would talk in Japanese to each other. But that was about it.AT: 11:58 Do you remember your grandparents well?
GH: 12:02 Um, sort of my, um, my mother's mother, uh, was, uh, she wasn't, she
didn't live in the same, uh, state. She was away. So I didn't know her really at all. I know my, my father's mother was in Chicago, but, uh, I didn't really know her that well.AT: 12:35 Did you, um, you mentioned that you had experienced a bit of a
prejudice in Rockford. Did you experience anything like that in Chicago?GH: 12:47 Yes. Oh yeah. I would say I could, and I mentioned, uh, I think until,
I think until I was about 10, 9 or 10, I felt prejudice and comments and that sort of thing. And then, uh, later in life, I think I had mentioned that kind of reversed itself to a point where I was given certain attributes and things, uh, which is fine with me. I mean,AT: 13:21 people making assumptions.
GH: 13:23 Yeah, good assumption, but you know, uh, as young adult, I even felt
very self conscious, like even dating outside of you know, I didn't feel that comfortable. Uh, uh, that's stuck with me for quite awhile. Psychologically it was [motions to head in a swirling manner]AT: 13:46 Why, why don't you, why didn't you feel comfortable? Or what do you think
GH: 13:51 something I think, I mean, Japanese had and then the way I was
treated, I think it affected me. And, uh, so for quite a while I felt very self conscious about it, somewhat uncomfortable almost. And uh, with that I would say, um, so I was probably in my thirties, maybe, you know, I got became, everything became quite pleasant to a point. I mean, I, I managed to, uh, you know, I went, I got a master's degree in a professional degree and in design, product design and I have a group, very good career, a good experience in that respect. Uh, so that was fine. You all of that was was great. Yeah.AT: 14:58 Um, earlier when we were speaking, you had mentioned um, And, and your
wife even mentioned that you, you can speak a bit to kind of the legacy of, of camp and, and this, um, this particular history. Could you speak a little bit more about, um, you know, what effects you've noticed throughout your life, um, the, the camps may have had on your family or,GH: 15:30 well, I would say um, the most dramatic effect I think was with my
dad, uh, who I believe, I really don't think he really recovered from the camps. Um, he in, on the farm in Puyallup, I mean he had a high school education that was pretty much it for him. Uh, but he was quite well received in Puyallup and her was kind of a community leader. Um, he actually had a nice life. Things, having the farm, just, um, parents having a farm and then he was going to take the, take the farm over. Also having four sons, were good. Yeah. He could rely on us to probably become the farmers. I think he was anticipating a very good life for himself. Um, so the more being taken off the farm, I was very disruptive for him in particular. And uh, he just as a, I just remember my dad, he just was, I just don't remember him never really been that happy, or, uh, you know, it was just kind of, he was just kinda going through life, you're just trying to make the best, you know do the best he could. It was never a very joyful situation. Uh, yeah, that's, that's what I remember. Um, when my mother, she was always determined to, you know, she always said, you guys are going to make something out of yourselves. I mean, just, you know, and that's, I think that's the thing that really resonated in my mind. That's, she said, don't give up, even though we didn't, we never had a great deal of money or means, uh, we figured it out one way or the other, how to do it. And I think that gave me a lot of strength. Um, you know, we didn't have the money, but I went through junior high school and then transferred, um, to IIT and I get the masters degree and all of my brothers have professional, you know, professional degrees. And, uh, we did, we did quite okay, you know, in life. Um, and then, so I think that in a strange way, they experience toughened us up. Uh, you know, it was good. I mean, it was, that's the positive part of it. And also, um, it forced us to get out of... Assimilate. We assimilated into society. So I think that's another positive thing about it. But I certainly would not want this to happen to any other, I wouldn't want it to happen to anybody else or to anybody. Yeah, I never really wanted to.AT: 19:00 If you could, um, pass along a message or a legacy to, to your own
children and family, kind of like your mother did to you? What would you want to say to them?GH: 19:18 Well, my daughter, I think she really, uh, does appreciate, uh, my
mom, I actually was, was fortunate. Is, uh, Rachel spent 14 quality years with my mother before she passed away. And, uh, my mother actually, uh, yeah, they were very close. She's, she's actually the only grandchild believe it or not, so she was, there was a lot of concentration of my mother's influence on her and intimate moments and that sort of thing. Uh, you know, uh, but I think Rachel, my daughter does appreciate what we went through. What my, uy mother, her grandmother went through. Uh, she's very aware of these things are socially, or... And teach, she teaches me lessons every day. She reminds me. Well in a sense, uh, she's very liberal minded. Very socially aware of these things. Uh and, so if there's any hint of me, uh, what can I say? Being insensitive about things, uh she'll something, take me to task on it for sure. Yeah. I mean, I'm an old guy. I mean, I, yeah. So that's, you know,AT: 21:25 And so, um, just as we wrap up here, why are, in your opinion, why,
why is this, what can we learn from this history, um, and this experience that you or your family and so many other families went through or, or what, what do we need to learn from it?GH: 21:52 Um, we have really be, well, we can never take anything for granted.
We really have to, I mean, look at what is going on today. I mean, is, I would say one thing our president is doing for us right now is waking us up. I mean, he is, things are so topsy turvy you just can't be, you can't ignore what's going on. And I think it's in a strange way that it's good. That's a good thing. Uh, and we need to always be vigilant and aware and not take things for granted at all. Um, you know, I would say that's, that's the thing that I resonates in my mind anyway. What can I say?AT: 23:02 Oh, is there anything else you might want to add or that I might've
missed that you want to?GH: 23:12 Hmm. I just, you know, I want to be a good person. Thats uh, I want to
live in the rest of my life. Uh, I, I certainly don't make the, as much of an effort as I could. Yeah, no, for sure. But, uh, I tried to get it away from myself personally, tried to do something good. For mankind, but I know you, I really have to, I have to force myself to do it, but I try, at least I try.AT: 23:55 Thank you so much for taking the time.
GH: 23:57 Thank you for asking me to do.
