[NOTE: This transcript has not undergone a final proofreading and may contain
errors. It is being provided in draft form to enhance access to the video recording. As soon as possible, it will be replaced with a final, corrected transcript and will be synced to the video to provide clickable timecodes.]Anna Takada: 00:00:00 To start, can you just state your full name?
Stanley Oda: 00:00:02 Sure. My name is Stanley Oda. Uh, I was born in Chicago
and, uh, I still live in Chicago.AT: 00:00:09 Okay. And, um, when, when is your birthday?
SO: 00:00:12 Birthday is August 16th, 1952. So I'm 65 years old. Uh, yeah, just
I was born in Chicago. Uh, I think it was Wesley Memorial Hospital on the South Side. Yeah. My family actually resettled on the South Side. So, uh, for the first, like 17 years of my life, I grew up on the South Side.AT: 00:00:34 Okay. Whereabouts on the South Side?
SO: 00:00:35 It was on 42nd place and Berkeley Avenue, which is, I guess you'd
consider that the Oakland [inaudible] neighborhood maybe. Uh, and yeah, so that's where I lived.AT: 00:00:49 And, um, so like I mentioned, we're interested in hearing about,
um, your family, your parents in front of your family's experiences during the war. So where were your parents from originally?SO: 00:01:05 Uh, they were actually born - my parents were born in California.
Uh, you know, that's a little vague to me. I would say my dad maybe in Visalia and maybe possibly my mom, but I'm not, that one I'm not sure about. Uh, they were, uh, my dad was born in 1919 and my mom was born in 1913 or '19, yeah, 1913.AT: 00:01:31 In what part of California is that?
SO: 00:01:33 Oh, that's kind of northern, uh, around I would guess around the
Sacramento area, somewhere around there. You know, what little east of, uh, east of San Francisco area more in the, in the middle of the state, you know, more mid-state.AT: 00:01:49 And um, how about your grandparents? Do you know about where they live?
SO: 00:01:54 They were in the Hiroshima area. Uh, yeah, I'm a little vague. I
don't know a whole lot about them. Uh, I never, you know, they were dead by the time I was born, so I don't really, I never met them or knew them. Uh, but yeah, my family is from the Hiroshima area.AT: 00:02:12 So both your mom's and your dad's -
SO: 00:02:14 Yes, yes.
AT: 00:02:16 Do you have any idea when they came to the US or was it just your parents?
SO: 00:02:22 Uh, no, I don't actually, I would guess that they came - since my
dad was born in 1919 - I would guess they came maybe in the, you know, early teens, maybe something like that.AT: 00:02:38 And, um, what do you know about their, their lives in California
growing up before the war?SO: 00:02:47 Uh, they were actually Kibei, so they were, even though they were
born in California, they, they probably spent only the first two or three years, maybe longer, maybe up to four, uh, and then they went back to Japan and they were actually went to school and were raised in Japan. And then they came back in the mid-thirties, like around 1936 or so. They came, they came back to California. Uh, so I mean, they kinda knew English, but they also really knew Japanese for a while. So, uh, I know we'll get into this later, but during the, during the war, uh, you know, my dad was in the MIS, so, uh, because of his knowledge of Japanese, I mean, he was a fluent Japanese speaker, so he was, uh, you know, so was, it was easier for him to, to do that job.AT: 00:03:35 Hmm. And do you have any idea or sense of what, um, brought them
back to the U.S.?SO: 00:03:43 I would say that, since they were American citizens I think they,
they, uh, wanted to come back, uh, partly I think that was one of the reasons, but, uh, you know, my dad had three other brothers and they all did the same thing. They were all born in California, but they went back to Japan and they were raised in Japan. But, uh, they all came back around 18, 19 years old. And, and that was I believe, Japan at the time had conscription going on. So at 19, you had to register or join or whatever. So, so, you know, so to avoid, it's probably not the right word, but to kind of not do that they, they, you know, they said, "okay, well, you know, we're American citizens, we'll come back," and avoid that hassle of having to do that.AT: 00:04:38 Hmm. And, um, how about your mom? Do you know the circumstances?
SO: 00:04:44 No, I would say that, um, my mom and dad actually knew each other
in Japan. Uh, and my, one of my, my dad's younger, younger brother was coming back to, to the United States in 1936. And so maybe she took that opportunity to come back with, you know, with, um, because she, she knew somebody. So, uh, she came back with my dad's brother, uh, to, to the United States at that time.AT: 00:05:17 Did they have any other family that was still in the U.S.?
SO: 00:05:21 No. I mean, there was an uncle that was - that lived in Arizona
that, uh, that was in, in this country. Uh, and he actually helped my dad's brothers and my dad - helped get back into the country because he vouched for them when they came they came to Angel Island and uh, you know, even though, you know, they could prove, probably fairly easily that they're citizens, uh, but what really helped to have that uncle there saying, okay, no, you know, they were born here and maybe he has some proof or something, so they weren't held at Angel Island for very long at all.AT: 00:06:01 And do you know anything about what your parents did once they
arrived back in the U.S.?SO: 00:06:08 Uh, they were, they went to high school. They went to high school a
little bit, but also, uh, my dad was - what do you call it - a houseboy where, you know, he kind of was a, worked for, uh, an American family doing, you know, the chores and stuff like that for them. Uh, you know, my, my mom, uh, I think she probably was like a nurse's aid or something like that.AT: 00:06:35 And what are your parents' names?
SO: 00:06:37 Well, my mom is Margaret and my Dad is Ted. And my mom's last name
is Takamia.AT: 00:06:44 Hmm. Um, okay. And then as far as you know, about, um, what they
were doing, like around the time when Pearl Harbor was attacked and the war broke out, um, what kind of happened in their lives?SO: 00:07:06 I'm sure it affected them a lot, uh, they were, uh, they were, uh,
I mean they were interned. So they were in the, uh, assembly center. They were in Santa Anita Assembly Center. Uh, they were still fairly young, so I don't think they really owned property, but they obviously lost their livelihood by, you know, having to go into the assembly center and, and the, and, and, and again, they didn't know each other. I mean, they kind of knew each other, but they weren't related. So, uh, after the assembly center, my mom was sent to Heart Mountain and my dad went to a Hamachi or Granada and with the younger brother, which was the same younger brother that came, came across with my mom. Uh, so, oh yeah.AT: 00:08:08 And, um, do you know, uh, let's see. Your dad was born in 1919, and
your mom was 1913? Okay. So they were, they were early twenties, then, at the time that the war broke out?SO: 00:08:30 Yes.
AT: 00:08:31 Um, do you, did they share with you, um, any information or, or
memories or anything about their experiences?SO: 00:08:47 Not really, they didn't really talk about it as, as, as common, uh,
that I hear anyways common. Uh, they, they really didn't talk about it at all. I mean, I really only learned about internment, the whole whole thing, you know, later on in college and stuff. So I didn't really, really know about it or they didn't talk about it at all actually.AT: 00:09:13 And so the information that you do [inaudible], you do know about,
um, where they went and all of that, did that come from them directly or how did you -SO: 00:09:23 No that came from the afterwards just during - once I got
interested in, in the, in the incarceration and everything. I, I, you know, yeah, I just kind of dug up, dug around myself. Uh, obviously the government, you know, government archives, online archives where I'll find a lot, I mean that I was in, you know, ancestry.com and, and just trying to find records and stuff, so I was there. I'm able to piece together a lot of it.AT: 00:09:52 Hmm. And do you have a sense of how long they were in either?
AT: 00:09:57 Sure. Yeah. My dad, uh, was probably from Granada, I mean, yeah, in
Granada. He was probably there from, I actually knew- know - the dates, but I should've looked it up before I came. Uh, it was probably maybe July of '42 or so that him and the younger brother, uh, Dick Oda was, uh, interned but then they weren't there for very long because in December '42, they volunteered for the MIS. So they were only in Granada for maybe four months or so. Um -AT: 00:10:43 And that was both your uncle and your dad?
SO: 00:10:46 Yeah, my uncle, yeah, my dad, they both volunteered at the same
time. So there's - I even think their serial numbers were only, you know, one one apart. Uh, and they, you know, they both volunteered. Uh, so they were, so they weren't incarcerated for very long. My mom on the other hand, uh, she was she went, went to Heart Mountain, uh, again, probably from early summer '42. And this I found out fairly recently, I was out and she transferred to Poston because most of her family was, excuse me, because most of her family was in Poston. And I, I've always tried to find out when does she transfer when does she transfer? I actually found out really recently that it was like in February of '43 that she transferred from Heart Mountain to Poston to be closer to her family members.AT: 00:11:44 Do you know what family she had?
SO: 00:11:47 Yeah, it was like a - she had, she had a brother. Yeah, her
brother, uh, and his family and some of his relatives that she knew were in Poston, so that's why she transferred to Poston. And then she was probably in Poston until the end of the war.AT: 00:12:12 And then, um, what do you know or what can you tell me about how
long are, um, what happens after the war? I guess for your mom's or - or what happens, you know, what was their next move or step?SO: 00:12:36 Okay. Yeah. My, as I said, my dad was in the MIS. Uh, it was my -
was his younger brother. They've volunteered at the same time, but also my dad also had two other brothers who were drafted who were actually drafted. Um, and they claimed right before, right before that they were drafted, before the war but looking at online records, it looks like they were both drafted maybe in, in January of '42. So it was maybe right, you know, a month after the war started. But um -AT: 00:13:08 You have any idea how that works? That two of those four boys?
SO: 00:13:13 Yeah. Uh Huh.
AT: 00:13:14 Two of them were drafted. And then the other two -
SO: 00:13:16 I guess maybe because just a matter of luck? Maybe whether you're
called up or not? I don't know. They have a lottery thing or are they, yeah, I don't know how that worked because, uh, because I actually, the oldest brother was drafted, my dad's twin brother was drafted, but my dad and his younger brother weren't. So maybe if another top two or three months later, if the war hadn't started, maybe they would've been drafted too possibly. But, uh, I don't know the story to that, but, uh, so yeah, my dad's oldest brother and obviously being Japanese American, they, I'm sure they weren't sure what exactly to do with him because he was already in the army. Uh, I know he went to, uh, cook school or cooking school, uh, somewhere in Illinois or maybe Wisconsin. And then eventually he joined the MIS and became an instructor there. Uh, and my dad's twin brother who was drafted. Joined - once the 442nd was, was established - he, he, he joined that. So, uh, so he, he joined and obviously was trained probably at Camp Shelby and Mississippi, and then were sent overseas. So he actually saw, saw combat. Um, yeah, I think, I believe he was in company I on on the 442nd. Um, my dad, once he graduated from the MIS school which was probably June-ish of '43, um, along with my younger brother, Dick, uh, Dick was sent to the Aleutians right away, um, because the Japanese was, uh, in the process of invading the Aleutians. Uh, my dad was sent to check the China, Burma, India theater of war. So he spent most of its duty in India. His commander - his commander was a non-American, but British, because the British were kind of in charge of that theater of operation, I believe. Uh, so I mean, as an aside, uh, because of that when I was born, he wanted to name me "Archibald" because that's a very British name. And he must've liked it, but of course my mom said, "no way Archibald?" So she said that it was either Stephen or Stanley. So they, they went with Stanley. And then my, my cousin who is like 12 years older than me, she told me the story of that, um, I was named after Stan Musial, which is a baseball player, a famous baseball player at the time. Uh, that's why Stan, you know, Stanley - uh, that I don't, I've never heard, that's the only time I've heard that - but that starts, she's still, she's telling me, uh, well, sorry for kind of going off on a tangent there. Yeah. And, uh, so yeah. So my dad spent all this time in the China, Burma, India, theater of war. I know. He told me stories about on leave, like going to the Taj Mahal. So he thought was really impressive and to this - and, and like a year before he died, he mentioned that he would've liked to have gone, like to go back, but we never were able to do that. So I, you know, he's, you know, he would, I know he was really impressed by that. Um, yeah, we have pictures of him riding a motorcycle and, and uh, and stuff like that there. Uh, and -AT: 00:17:21 Do you know how long, uh, he and his brother were in service? In
the MIS?SO: 00:17:26 Yeah, I would say my dad - I mean, I think - except for uncle Peter
though - all of [inaudible] were instructors in the MIS and the other three brothers were stationed in Japan after the war and the occupation. And I think my dad was the first to come back. I think he came back around maybe '47-ish or something. Uh, I think my uncle Peter - Mary the Japanese woman, and he brought her back I believe, maybe 1952, '51, '52, maybe. And my, my dad's youngest brother, Dick, stayed the longest. And he didn't come back 'til probably '54 and he also married a Japanese woman and brought her back at that time.AT: 00:18:38 And, so when your dad came back - or did he come back?
SO: 00:18:45 He came back to Chicago. Uh, I'm not sure exactly why, but my guess
is that he knew people who are here, had friends who are here, uh, had heard Chicago was kind of more welcoming place, uh, for Japanese Americans. Um, and I know that. Yeah. You know, I, I, eh, you know, after the war, the Chicago Japanese population grew with like 20,000 or something, so, and they were kind of Japanese communities, like one on the North Side, one on the South Side, and he kind of picked the South Side community to live in. So yeah.AT: 00:19:24 Um, do you know where he moved to when he first came to Chicago? On
the South Side?SO: 00:19:30 Uh, I would say he moved to the apartment that we, you know, cause
he met my mom and they got married and then they moved into this apartment, big apartment building, that I grew up in and their address was, um, 4700 South Berkeley Avenue. It was, it was a big, uh, big multi-unit apartment building. And it actually has two entrances as there was, uh, the main entrance that was the 4700 address. But also it was on the corner, so they also had another entrance which had a different address address, which was 1019 42nd place. Um, and, and my dad was the kind of superintendent of the building, so, uh, and I would guess it was probably, you know, probably had at least 30 units in the building. So it was pretty big. Yeah, it's pretty big.AT: 00:20:33 And um, as far as, um, his relationship with your mom, did they
reconnect in Chicago? Is that how they got together or do you have any details about that?SO: 00:20:48 I think they probably corresponded and they did get together in
Chicago. I want to say they got married in Chicago cause I know I've seen the wedding pictures. Uh, and I know my cousin Oh, who told me the story about my name being named after Stan Musial. She - that whole family was in Chicago.AT: 00:21:18 Who was her father? Which brother?
SO: 00:21:21 Well, let's see. My cousin was actually, that cousin was actually
my mom's sister - my mom's sister with her mother. And so they were in Chicago, so they - so I think they - but they settled on the North Side, but, my cousin Alice was born in 1940 so, so she grew up in the camps, so she was about maybe five, you know, once when, uh, when the camps closed. Uh, and she was all old enough to, uh, kinda help my mom and family out. And I, I kind of remember, I think I saw she was at the wedding. I think I've seen the picture of her at my mom and dad's wedding. So I think because, you know, they were there already in that, that's what draw drew everyone to Chicago.AT: 00:22:22 That family had kind of already come in.
SO: 00:22:26 [speakers overlap] Yeah, yeah.
AT: 00:22:29 Do you have a sense of - so your mom, do you know when she came to Chicago?
SO: 00:22:38 No, I want to say that looking at the records online, she left
Poston and, and got a job somewhere in Illinois. Uh, again, uh, maybe as a nurses aid or something at some hospital. I should have looked - I don't remember the town, but it was somewhere probably fairly close and not really close to Chicago suburb but you know somewhere fairly close but not like in the metropolitan area.AT: 00:23:13 And then at some point you must've come into the city.
SO: 00:23:20 Yeah, yeah. I think she, you know, she met my dad again and they
got married and that's when they, I'm sure that's when she moved to the city.AT: 00:23:31 Um, okay. And then, so your mom was in Chicago with some family,
most likely, and then your dad came in '47. Um, do you know what kind of work - did your dad immediately go into the superintendent position?SO: 00:23:53 No, they were, they were actually - my sister was born in 1950 and
they actually had a variety store, um, on Allison Avenue near Montrose. And yeah, I, I, I know my family still hadf stories and maybe I've even heard this from my cousin that, uh, it was kind of a variety store. They had toys and stuff too, but other sundries and um, and my sister was born in 1950 and my - sometimes my mother would leave her in a buggy in the window, uh, and people would pass by and say "oh" and think that's a doll or something and want to buy her. Uh, and so yeah, they had this variety store. Uh, probably not too long, I would say. You know, I was born in '52, so I'm not sure if they still had it by the time I was born - I mean, I don't have, I have no recollection of it, so I don't, I really don't know if they still have it then or not. But after the variety store, my dad went into the superintendent.AT: 00:25:05 Um, do you have any idea if they were living on the South Side
still and then would they commute up to Allison in Montrose?SO: 00:25:14 Yeah, I would, I would say that they, they commuted. Yes.
AT: 00:25:18 Have you ever seen any pictures or something like that?
SO: 00:25:21 No. You know, I kind of walked the block I thought it was on, but
you know, I don't know what to kind of look for. I mean I think I know the block, but I think I would lean like - again, my cousin Alice was older, she might remember a few things where it was, so I probably should go with her and just walk the block or to the say and she might say, "oh yeah, this was the place or this was close to the place," then it was. Yeah.AT: 00:25:53 And do you think that was a family operation? Like more than just
your parents?SO: 00:25:57 No, I think it was just my mom and dad. Yeah. Uh-huh.
AT: 00:26:01 um, okay. So you have an older sister who was born in 1950?
SO: 00:26:06 Right. Uh-huh.
AT: 00:26:06 What's her name?
SO: 00:26:08 Her name is Christine.
AT: 00:26:10 And then were you the next one?
SO: 00:26:13 Yes. And then I have a younger sister, uh, another two years apart.
'54 her name is Susanna.AT: 00:26:23 Um, and you said that the, the building at 42nd and Berkeley, you
were in that for 17 years?SO: 00:26:34 Yeah, let me think. I can even give the exact date probably. Cause
I was there for freshman year in high school. And then we moved right before, for sophomore year. So let's see, I graduated high school in '69 so I started in '65, so it's probably '66 that we moved, uh, that we moved north.AT: 00:27:01 And um, can you tell me a little bit about, uh, what it was like
growing up in the South Side in the area?SO: 00:27:11 Yeah, I would say - you know, I didn't think anything about it
being dangerous or anything. I mean, people think of the South Side now or thinking look at the neighborhood now and they think, oh, you know, how could, you know, you know, but uh, at the time, I mean, growing up I didn't think it was dangerous at all. I mean, we went to - the grammar school we went to what's called Doniatte and it's not there anymore, but it was on 42nd place, uh, about maybe three and a half blocks west. So we - we walked it every day. I think my mom actually you know took us there and back every day. Um, you know, then we're a block from 43rd street, which was a real big commercial district. You know, there were supermarkets, there was a Walgreens, you know, there were restaurants and, and you know, a shoe store, you know, clothing stores, things like, yeah. I mean, anything you would want, you could just walk up to 43rd street and get.AT: 00:28:25 What were the demographics of the neighborhood at the time?
SO: 00:28:29 You know, I would say it was mainly, uh, mainly African American. I
mean, there was another Japanese American family on our block, I think, uh, you know, I don't remember their names. They were like - we're on the corner -maybe a half a block south of us, um, there was another Japanese family, which, yeah, I knew my parents knew real well, you know, I would say hi to them if I saw them in the yard or something. But, uh, yeah, I don't remember their names, but that's the one, the other Japanese American family, uh, that I knew of except my, again, my youngest - my dad's younger brother, uh, my dad got him an apartment building, not that close, but fairly close. It was on Oakenwald and 47th street. So it was probably about one, two, three, four, maybe an eight block walk or something. Uh, and so, yeah, so that we, we would go there all the time.AT: 00:29:35 But besides that you didn't know -
SO: 00:29:38 No, no, I don't think I did. Uh, you know, my, in school at
Doniatte, uh, you know, it was mainly African American. I was the only, you know, I could think - besides my sisters - I think we were the only Japanese American kids in the school. Uh, yeah, there's a church we used to go to, which was on 46th and Greenwood, which is called a -AT: 00:30:09 What kind of church was it?
SO: 00:30:10 Yeah my impression was that it was a Methodist church but I could
be wrong. Uh, it was on 46 in Greenwood and we would go to Sunday school there. And then, uh, you know, I can't say my parents were members of the - you know, we went to church there, but we did go to Sunday school there. Um, I think it was called Kenwood. Maybe. Maybe it's changed its name. I think it's called Kenwood United Church of Christ right now, today. But yeah, I want us, you know, my memory says it was, you know, Kevlin Methodist Church, maybe, I could be wrong, but that's my impression.AT: 00:30:52 And do you know about your, your parents, um, religious
backgrounds, how they grew up and how they feel you're doing [inaudible]?SO: 00:31:00 No. You know, my dad, no, I don't know. I mean, when they came to
the, I mean, in Chicago he attended, uh, there was, I know there was a Buddhist church you probably went to occasionally. I mean, neither my parents were, I would say real religious. Uh, but they made us go to Sunday school, which I was happy for, I mean, you know, there were things you learned in Sunday school, you don't learn anywhere else and you know that - yeah, I'm glad I did that actually.AT: 00:31:39 Um, besides school and church, were there any other activities that
you were involved in as a child?SO: 00:31:45 You know, in seventh grade I joined the Boy Scouts. Uh, so that was
fine. I mean we went on some camping trips and stuff like that. But other than that, I can't say were that involved in anything. Um,AT: 00:32:11 Can you tell me more about, um, the Boy Scouts [inaudible]?
SO: 00:32:15 Sure. Let's say, uh, you know, I went to Doniatte [inaudible] up to
sixth grade and they, that's how - that's how as high as they went. So for seventh and eighth grade we had to go somewhere else and one school, one more well known school, it's probably still there. It was called Oakenwald school. But, uh, they didn't have a good reputation. So my parents decided to send me to a school in Hyde Park, which was a, yeah, which wasn't that far, but it was, I, I couldn't walk out, you know, I ended up, I ended up taking the bus there, uh, and in order to, in order to do that, actually we had to kind of be in the district. So they got a friend of theirs who lived in the district to say, I, we live, you know, we live there. Uh, and again, I don't know the friend's name, I know they live, I think they lived on Dorchester and 53rd or 52nd and Dorchester. Um, so I was able to go to - and again my older sister, uh, I know why we went to do two different elementary schools. My, my sister went to an elementary school called Ray in Hyde Park and I went to one called Bret Harte in Hyde Park. Um, so, so that for, so, so for seventh and eighth grade I went the Bret Harte, which was pretty much an all white school. Uh, and, and making friends there, you know, that's for, that's when I joined the boy scout troop there. Um, because most of my classmates were actually in that same troop. Uh, what was it like? I remember I actually had a good time. I remember going to the troop meetings, you gonna learn how to tie knots, learn how to, you know, light a fire with some flint and some, you know, some kindling and stuff, and uh, we went on camping trips, uh, overnight camping trips. Um, so it was, it was fun. I had a good time in the boy scouts. I don't recall being in it for very long, I guess seventh, maybe eighth grade, but after eighth grade, you know, I didn't go, you know, I didn't do it anymore, but it was a good time. I enjoyed it. Uh, yeah, I remember having, you know, to buy like the uniform and stuff and, and I think a lot of the uniform we bought from a friend of mine in school who was in grade school, who was for some reason selling his stuff. Maybe he was, I don't know if he was not doing the boy scouts anymore or this was some spare stuff he had, but I remember going to his house and buying it used because my parents were actually, you know, not well to do so they, uh, you know, we definitely, you know, when we bought it used it was a lot cheaper.AT: 00:35:43 Um, so it sounds like between home and church and school, you
weren't really around other Japanese Americans?SO: 00:35:54 No, I wasn't, you know, I, I didn't know any other Japanese
American kids. I want to say until high school. Um, yeah, I think that, you know, as I was growing older on the South Side, I think the Japanese American community on the South Side was kinda slowly disintegrating a little bit. And, and, and I know my mom and dad kind of wished in hindsight that maybe they had moved to the North Side enclave. Uh, but I know I should maybe backtrack a little bit. You know, my dad was superintendent of the building we're living in, but then he decided to buy the building, so, and, and a Japanese American person owned the building. So, you know, he, he, he was buying, you know, he was making payments to this person. Um, you know to buy the building. Uh, eventually my dad actually lost the building because it was getting harder and harder for him to collect the rent, um, because people were falling behind. And he finally ended up hiring a management company to collect the rent and pay the bills. Uh, but they ended up cheating my dad. So they, they, they took the money and then didn't pay any bills. So it was like two years later or something my dad, you know, find out about this and, uh, but you know, it was so much money that he owed for, you know, like utilities and, you know, just the building, the mortgage and, uh, you know, it was just too overwhelming. Uh, so we actually ended up losing the building, um, and that - and that's actually one reason we ended up moving out of the South Side and we, and we move north, uh, you know, right before my sophomore year in high school. Uh, so I know that was fairly real traumatic experience for him because he worked really hard, you know, to keep up the building and, uh, yeah, I know he, he wanted to own it and it didn't work out.AT: 00:38:42 So with that, that was probably around the late sixties?
SO: 00:38:50 Yeah. That was, uh, let's say '66 probably. Yeah. When that
happened. So we, so we moved north and we moved into an apartment building that my dad's twin brother, the one who was in the 442nd, uh, he, he kind of, I wouldn't say he owned it, but he was maybe the super of that building. So my dad was able to get an apartment. Um, my mom and dad were able to get an apartment in this building.AT: 00:39:24 And where was this?
SO: 00:39:24 It was on Kyler Avenue, Kyler and, and, and Broadway. And Kyler is
a block north of Burnham park. Uh, the address, I, you know, I, I want to say it's 838 Kyler, but that could be totally wrong, but that number sticks to my mind. Uh, and, and then, so my, my uncle lived there, so, you know, I had, uh, you know, he had four children, so they were, they, you know, they were there, so I had people to play with and stuff like that.AT: 00:39:57 Hmm. Um, one thing I wanted to ask about before talking about the
North Side, do you remember any, uh, Japanese American owned businesses or restaurants or anything like that in the South Side?SO: 00:40:11 You know, let's see. Yeah, I kinda do maybe do remember going to
one. It was more Hyde Park, maybe, it was, maybe it was on Hyde Park boulevard and 51st street. Possibly. I remember going there a few times with my family. Um, yeah. Restaurant wise, we didn't eat out a lot, cause we weren't that well to do, so we didn't eat out that often. And when we did, I think we probably went to the North Side, maybe somewhere on Clark, you know, North Clark Street. We went to, you know, some restaurants, some occasionally, uh, um -AT: 00:41:02 Do you remember a grocery store?
SO: 00:41:04 Yeah, I remember a grocery store going to a grocery store somewhere
in the Hyde Park area, you know, that, you know what it was called or exactly where it was, I don't remember.AT: 00:41:16 Did you eat Japanese food at home?
SO: 00:41:19 You know, I wasn't that adventurous. I mean, I, you know we liked
sashimi. I liked sashimi a lot. Uh, that, you know, I, I ate whenever we had at, which wasn't very often, but I did like the sashimi. Yeah. You know other stuff, you know, octopus, eel, my dad, my dad and my mom liked that, uh, even, uh, mochi. I mean, I like the plain mochi, but my dad liked the stuff with the stuff inside of it and you know, and I, you know, I said, nah, I don't think I'll go for that, but I like the plain mochi. Yea, uh, so yeah, we were brought up more on, you know, American food, but I mean, my mom cooked rice every day. I mean, every, every night, every, every dinner. My, you know, my mom and dad ate rice every night. Uh, besides that, uh, I would say it was more American food.AT: 00:42:22 I also wanted to ask about, um, Japanese language. Did you speak
Japanese with your parents?SO: 00:42:28 No. You know, again, my mom and dad, again, not talking about the
internment, they wanted to bring us up American. So I mean, they spoke Japanese, they didn't teach. They didn't, they didn't endeavor to teach us Japanese. I mean, any Japanese I learned was through Osmosis with them talking to each other. I mean, they never said no, we're going to sit down and teach you. Well, I can't say that's true. I remember one point maybe when I was maybe 10 years old or something, my dad said, okay, I'm going to try to teach you guys Japanese. But you know, it doesn't last very long. I don't think, uh,AT: 00:43:12 Could you understand it when they speak?
SO: 00:43:14 Mmm, ah, I can maybe get the gist of maybe what they were talking
about, but no, I couldn't, you know, you know, to this day, I mean, I might know, you know, a couple hundred words, but that said, you know, yeah.AT: 00:43:29 Um, okay. So going back to the move to the North Side, um, to Kyler
Broadway, um, can you tell me a little bit about what that move was like for you? Maybe how the neighborhood is different?SO: 00:43:45 Yeah, I would say that, you know, the, towards the end of our stay
on the South Side, yeah, I did feel some racial tension maybe. Uh, I remember my cousin when one day my cousin came to visit and then we said, well, let's walk, there was like a playground maybe a couple blocks away and it was in actually a low-income housing complex. They had just kind of a high rise and then they have a playground play area. So we walked over there and then, uh, I remember that. You know, some of the kids there were trying to say, you know, we can't, you know, you can't come here. We don't belong here. And, uh, I would say we could've gotten into a fight, but one of the people there knew me from school, so he kind of diffused the situation a little bit. But yeah, that, that was one of the few times where I felt kind of a racial tension being in that area. Um, so yeah, when we move north, yeah, I changed high schools, so I, the first year on the South Side I went to Hyde Park High, which was a very integrated school. I mean, there was a - I don't know what the percentages were - but I mean it was, it was really integrated.AT: 00:45:33 Did you, did you have other, um, Japanese American classmates at
Hyde Park?SO: 00:45:42 No, I can't say I did. I mean, I had a lot of the people I knew
were actually from, you know, from my eighth grade class. I'm, a lot of them were, were uh, oh, the Jewish religion. So, uh, they, I knew them a lot. Yeah. Japanese, I can't say I knew any Japanese Americans in High Park, even though my sister was going there, she graduated from Hyde Park, so she had to be, when I was there as a freshman, she had to be yet a junior or senior there. Um, but yeah, I can't, say I knew any Japanese Americans you know in Hyde Park High, uh, when we move north, you know, I went to, I went to Lane Tech and that's where, when I, I, I got to know what some other Japanese Americans in Lane Tech.AT: 00:46:41 Was that still an all boys school?
SO: 00:46:43 Yeah, it was still an all boys school. I graduated in '69. I think
they went co-ed maybe a year or two after that.AT: 00:46:52 Um, and how would you describe, um, well first of all, how, what
was, what neighborhood is Kyler in Broadway called [inaudible]?SO: 00:47:11 Would that be called? Oh, I'm not sure maybe possibly uptown. I
mean, it's on the southern end, fringe of uptown, if it was uptown. Uh, yeah, and we didn't stay there that long, I think we were there a year or two at the most. Then we moved to another place on Montrose in Greenview. And that address was 4413 and a half [laughter] and that was a courtyard building. So they - that's why in some courtyard buildings, the post office gave a half to some of the addresses itself. They wouldn't use up a lot of numbers.AT: 00:48:09 And uh, so that move was while you're still [inaudible]?
SO: 00:48:11 Yeah, I want to say, yeah, we probably were only at Kyler for a
year maybe. So it was probably the last two years of high school. Yeah. We were at the Greenview addressAT: 00:48:25 And remind me, that building on Kyler - your uncle was there?
SO: 00:48:30 Yeah, my uncle was there, you know, maybe he was the superintendent
of that building. So after we moved out, I think he probably moved, uh, somewhere else.AT: 00:48:46 Can you tell me a little bit about your experiences, um, going to
Lane Tech and I'm living on the North Side [inaudible]?SO: 00:48:54 Yeah, I would say it was a totally different experience at Hyde
Park. Uh, again, there were just, there were some racial tension. I mean, uh, I remember, I mean, it was at the time there were, you know, the big gangs in the area were Gangster Disciples and the Blackstone Rangers were the two big gangs around the, around the high school. Um, and I would sometimes walk with some friends from Hyde Park High, which was on like 62nd and Stony Island to, uh, where they lived in, in Hyde Park, which was maybe around like 53rd or something. So we had to walk, you know, maybe 10 blocks or so, uh, to get to their house. And I remember one time we were, it was just me and another friend of mine, we were passing, we're walking and then a gang of, of kids, I don't know, maybe a dozen people, we passed, and then, um, then they started chasing us and I said, "oh my God." So we ended up, uh, you know, running and then eventually knocking on a door. And then, uh, and luckily someone was home and they opened the door and those people who were chasing us, kind of stopped and kind of walked away. Um, so, you know, that was one experience I had, uh, another experience. I was actually in summer school taking a history course. Um, was it history or was it typing? I don't know, I took maybe - did I take both? Yeah, maybe I did take typing and history that one summer, I don't remember, but yeah. But, uh, I remember, and that was in Hyde Park High. And I remember at lunch or something, I walked and went outside and it was just sitting on kind of like, yeah, not the stoop that they had, you know, where the grass was, but they had a kind of a raised grass area and they had an edging around it, so I was sitting there and this kid came up to me and wanted my watch. I remember, you know, I didn't want to give it to him when he said, and then he was kind of saying he the didn't want to take it, he said, "oh, just lend it to me, I'll give it back to you later." So we had a back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. And finally, you know, I think he never did take the watch, but again, it kind of told me I shouldn't sit out there alone anymore. Um, so anyway, going to the North Side now, I guess I didn't have those things happen to me on the North Side. Um, you know, I'm sure there were gangs around, but yeah, I didn't, I didn't have any, uh, you know, feel any of that. Um, I think the - I think the school Blaine was probably a better school than Hyde Park High. Um, there were more, you know, it was a big school. I mean, you know, when I was there I think they had like 5,000 students there and my graduating class was probably almost a thousand, so I mean, it was a big school having just to get used to the size. Uh, I mean it was, uh, it was, it was, it was intimidating at first, but, um, and I was kind of always, I, I've always been kind of a shy person, uh, and kept to myself, so, yeah. So, you know, I wasn't, I never didn't have that many - I've never had, you know, that many friends. So. Yeah.AT: 00:53:32 When you were at Lane Tech, were you involved in any other
activities besides school?SO: 00:53:38 Yeah. Let's see. I joined a few clubs. I joined the math club, I
joined the astronomy club. I think, um, yeah, there was a stamp club I possibly joined.AT: 00:53:54 Were you all going to church still? Or -
SO: 00:54:03 I would say no, I think once we moved north, I don't think we
actually found a church to go to. Um, you know my dad would still go to his, you know, his, his church occasionally. Uh, but I would say that, no, we didn't, we didn't go the go the church once we came north.AT: 00:54:30 And then, uh, same question as I asked when you're on the South
Side, do you remember any, um, Japanese American [inaudible] or she stays in the North Side?SO: 00:54:43 Yeah, I remember, uh, yeah, definitely around Clark and Belmont
area, there were, there were several [inaudible] I think was there, there were, you know, two or three Japanese restaurants along the Clark street strip. There was a Japanese grocery store, maybe a block and a half - two blocks north of Belmont and Clark, uh, that we went to a lot. Um -AT: 00:55:09 Is that Star Market?
SO: 00:55:10 Yeah, there was Star Market. Yes. Uh Huh. That was Star Market. Um,
you know, I think there was probably Kyo's restaurant was there at the time was another restaurant, I don't remember the name, further north there was on Broadway, north of Lawrence [inaudible] there was Zuma that another restaurant we went to. Um, so yeah, there was definitely, there was like, yeah, there were several Japanese businesses all along Clark Street area that I remember.AT: 00:56:00 And did you and your family, did you frequent any of those? You
said you went to Star Market a bit?SO: 00:56:07 Yeah, I can't say we did a lot,again, yeah, we weren't that well to
do, so we didn't eat out a lot. Uh, but you know, for my - if my folks need to buy, you know, Japanese food or something, you know, they would, they would go there.AT: 00:56:21 What was Star Market like? From your memory.
SO: 00:56:25 My, my memory was, it was fairly small. Uh, I remember, you know it
small. Yeah. I don't, you know, I don't know. I mean, uh, I do remember one thing and you know, going back to the South Side, going to the Japanese market on the South Side, I remember I have a memory of going with my dad and going to the, the butcher and my dad wanting some sashimi and the butcher brought out this huge big tuna -and I had never seen a fish that big before - and he cut out pieces of sashimi for my dad. And I said I had no idea that fish was so big and that this is where it came from. Uh, you know, I still have that memory in my mind, but, um, but no, I, I don't remember, remember Star Market that well.AT: 00:57:25 Do you think there was - is there any certain points or, or time in
your life where you, um, I guess became aware or maybe in touch with or, um, yeah, get so aware of you're, you're Japanese American identity?SO: 00:57:48 Uh, I would say it wasn't probably until in college that, you know,
I learned about the incarceration and, uh, and I wanted to know more about it and maybe I'm trying to maybe learn the language a little bit more. I remember after school, after I graduated, yeah, I remember taking a Sumei class where, you know, you know, I was at an [inaudible] I think, Wright Junior college had a class for 10 or 12 weeks or something once a week. And yeah, yeah, I, I enjoyed that. It was very, uh, very peaceful for me to do that and to learn that.AT: 00:58:37 And what college did you go to?
SO: 00:58:39 I went to University of Illinois, Champaign-Urbana. I graduated in '73.
AT: 00:58:47 Can you tell me more about your experience learning about, um, the incarceration?
SO: 00:58:54 Sure. I would say - I mean, it was a slow process. I mean, uh, my
mom and dad never did want to talk about it. Even when I asked them questions about it, you know, uh, yeah, I think the because, oh yeah, my mom said, yeah, "I was in Heart Mountain and uh, and Poston," so I kind of maybe knew where she was, but to get any type of detail out of them, it was, it was impossible. Um -AT: 00:59:26 And this was, um, when you were college aged?
SO: 00:59:29 Yeah, I was probably, yeah, probably during or slightly after
college. Yeah. Uh, and -AT: 00:59:35 have you known as the child or growing up at all?
SO: 00:59:40 No, I can't say I had a consciousness about it. No, no. Uh, no. I
don't think I did. I don't think I did.AT: 01:00:02 And then I, I wanted to ask about, uh, because clearly since that
time you developed an interest, as you've had quite a collection of your own with the posters and the loyalty questionnaire and some objects and articles from camp. Can you tell me a little bit about how you came upon collecting?SO: 01:00:27 Right, right. I would say that, yeah, as I learned more and more
about the incarceration, uh, as I did more research into what, uh, and you know, my mom and dad still have few things from the camps. Uh, I guess I, I, I started getting - first I started collecting books, uh, because I wanted to learn as much about it as I could. I figured, you know, there might be 30 or 50 books on incarceration, you know, but once I got into it, I mean, I, I think I have like 900 books now, um, in my collection. And not all of them are on incarceration. Some of them are like pre-war immigration and then the post-war things. But I would say a lot more, 90% of them at least is on incarceration. Uh, so once I started collecting books and started reading more about it. Um, yeah, you know I really got a real big interest in it and I decided to, I know don't, started to collect artifacts. I think maybe, you know, I had maybe visit - the first camp I visited was Manzanar. Uh, my wife and I had gone there, uh, not specifically gone to Manzanar but, we had gone to that valley and, um, I've always wanted to the see, you know, try to go to all the camps. And since we were, I mean, fairly close, I mean, not that close, fairly close, I said, "well, let's go up up there." And my wife was, um, interested too, so yeah. So we drove up to, to Manzanar and uh, and drove around and walked around. And, uh, and I think that's probably one of the best preserved camps. I mean, they, you know, they had a big cemetery, they had the auditorium and the auditorium - I know they had remodeled the auditorium now, but when we had gone, they had not done that. So uh, there was not an auditorium. And they have, you know, they still have the guard tower in the front - a guard shack in the front. And, uh, so, um, so I think that got me thinking about the artifacts and uh, and, and I'm wondering, you know, if any of the, the barracks room were left anymore and uh, and between that and, and no, and the things that my mom and dad still had kept and I said well, I want to preserve all of this and, and try to understand it more and try to preserve it and then pass it on to the next generation. Uh, so that's what started me in collecting.AT: 01:03:47 And why is that something that is important to you?
SO: 01:03:55 Yeah, I think, I think, you know, from a history standpoint, I
mean, we keep making the same mistakes all the time. I mean, history keeps repeating itself and, uh, I think it's worth people learning about what happened and knowing what happened to the Japanese Americans in World War II. And, and part of them learning about it is through the artifacts, and the books, uh, so it doesn't die. I mean, so the next generation would - can learn from it. And I think your exhibit here, I mean it's fantastic and it's going, it's helping, keeping that memory alive and now in the memory, but learning from it and saying, "no, we can't go down this road again, I mean, we can't, uh, you know, ban whole racial groups, uh, just because of how they look or their religion." I mean, uh, and you know, we're going through that now. So, uh, it's something that is, we need to learn from and, and, and keep, keep it alive. So that's why I'm doing it.AT: 01:05:15 With that said, I'm wondering if you could offer your thoughts or
reflections about, um, cause like you say, um, you know, unfortunately we often see history repeat itself and that's why it's important to preserve and document and share this history, um, given, uh, some of the current events and current political climate in the US and all of that. Can you share just, I guess, maybe some reflections on what exactly we need to learn from this history and how it can help us kind of navigate where we're at right now as a country.SO: 01:06:07 Yeah. I would say that, I mean, the rights guaranteed to us by the
constitution. I mean, they were so trampled on for Japanese Americans during the war that, uh, then you have the supreme court that upholds some basic rights for Japanese Americans. Uh, and you know, I think it's important that, you know, people look at that and say, wow, you know, through prejudice or hysteria or, or, or, um, whatever, uh, you know, there're certain rights that you can't, that are given to Americans that you can't, you can't abrogate because of some situation. Uh, and that, you know, prejudice I think will always be there. Uh, but hopefully, you know, we'll have enlightened leaders that understand that and, and, and will not realize that. No, you know, be, we'll be strong enough to say no, you know, it might be easy. It might be, uh, convenient to go along with the masses who might want to incarcerate a bunch of people or because of their religion or race. Uh, but I think, you know, leadership needs to be stronger to say, "no," you know, "this is the country we stand for." This is the freedoms we offer. Uh, this is our constitution and no matter what you may think - I mean the constitution gives us, everyone, equal rights and that you might not agree with them. Uh, you might not agree with what people are say or what they stand for, but as long as they are within the law, you know, they have the right to their opinion in their speech, uh, and their religion. Uh, so hopefully, you know, people can learn from the Japanese American experience and, and, and say all the leadership might have been weak at that time, but, you know, let's learn from it and be strong.AT: 01:08:29 Um, I'm getting the sense that you were kind of, you were already
delving into this history by the time that redress, um, and t\hat whole campaign.SO: 01:08:40 Yes. Yes. Huh.
AT: 01:08:41 Can you tell me a little bit about, um, your memories of that, that
time and maybe some of your reactions?SO: 01:08:49 You know what, I wasn't that, you know, the redress movement was
not something that I was really maybe understood, not maybe knew about that much at the time. Uh, you know, I know they had a hearing or hearing in Chicago. I, you know, I didn't, I don't know why, but I wasn't, you know, it wasn't something I I Kinda knew about. Um, I - so, yeah, I, I don't know how to answer that. If I had known about it, uh, yeah, you know, I definitely would have been maybe involved in it, but that I didn't - to be honest I didn't even know about it - what was going on at the time. Yeah. I want to think what was happening in my life. I don't know. Yeah. Uh, yeah, I was very happy when my mom and dad both got, you know, checks for $20,000. I was like, you know, but, uh, yeah, that was, yeah, that was my involvement in it.AT: 01:10:00 Did they have any particular reactions to it that you recall?
SO: 01:10:07 Uh, yeah, I think they were good - happy it happened. Uh, I think
the apology, they got meant something to them. Um, because the money was, I mean was something but didn't cover anything of their losses or stuff that they went through. Uh, but, I think yeah, they were, they were, they were supportive. They definitely, they were supporters of it.AT: 01:10:49 And, um, so was Manzanar the only camp that you -
SO: 01:10:55 No, I, and the - I've seen two of the camps. I wish I had seen
more. But uh went to Poston, um, yeah you know, there's a big monument there. Uh, we went to the monument, but then, you know, I asked - there was a firehouse fire station next door. And I asked the people there, "you know, is there a any other camps to left?" And they said, "yeah, there's," you know, "a half mile down the road, uh," you know, "there, there's some buildings there." So, you know, we drove there and, and there was a whole kind of fenced in area, pretty large fenced in the area that was there. So we, we stopped there and, and we're trying to figure out how to get in and we walked all the way around and find that there was - I wouldn't say entrance - but there was a place where the barbwire fence was, you know, was, was open. So we said, okay, we could get in. So well so we walked in there and they have one, one, one barracks. They had moved there. Uh, but with, mainly it was mainly the, the school area. There was all Adobe buildings there that was the grammar school and, and, and, and possibly high school classes there now that were still there. And there was a, and there was actually an auditorium that was there, but it had burned someone had burned it down fairly recently. Uh, so that, so the walls were still there for that. Then there was a giant warehouse, which I'm not sure was original or was, was, uh, uh, was something the tribe - cause it was on tribal land, maybe the tribal government had erected - uh, yeah, you know to them I'm not sure if that big warehouse was original or not, but, uh, so we walked, you know, so we walked around there.AT: 01:12:43 What year was that?
SO: 01:12:45 That was fairly recently. That was a, I wanna say that was last
year, actually. Yeah. Spring of 2016. That's when we had gone there. Yeah.AT: 01:13:01 And did you say you went to one other?
SO: 01:13:03 No.
AT: 01:13:04 So just Poston.
SO: 01:13:06 Yeah, uh huh.
AT: 01:13:06 And, um, what was that like to, to be there in that space?
SO: 01:13:14 Oh, wow. It was, uh, it was emotional, uh, to, to be walking along,
uh, which is basically a prison camp, about you know where my mom was at and, um, you know, we actually did a small ceremony. My [inaudible] did a small ceremony at Poston. And um, to realize that, you know, our government had locked up people for no reason. It was real emotional and, and, and the visit Manzanar, I mean, the cemetery is still there, Manzanar and, uh, and that was, uh, you know, to see the cemetery and the big monument they have in the cemeteries. Yeah. And I, I think there's still people and some people still buried there. Uh, and all that. They died in a prison camp. I mean, that's, uh, uh, not knowing, you know, whether they'd be ever free again or what, what happened to them after the war. Uh, you know, that's sad, yeah, that's really sad.AT: 01:14:56 Um, and before we wrap up, I just have a few more questions. I'm
wondering if, uh, if you have a sense of, or I guess maybe if you've done some research on it or looked into the process and the experience of resettlement and kind of what happened to folks post-war and post-camp. Um, is that something that you've looked into?SO: 01:15:34 Well there's been a few things about it. I mean, even on the west
coast, I mean, a lot, a lot of people did return to the west coast and you know, some, some, I mean, I, I would say maybe half the people were okay with it. Other half of the people were still didn't want them back, maybe, so, so there were still a lot of prejudice and I mean a lot of violence and even shootings. Uh, and I mean even there's, there was a VFW post that didn't want returning nisei soldiers. And I think that was in the Oregon to, to, uh, be part of the part of the membership. And so, yeah, I mean there was, um, so I think that's why a lot of the people did end up coming to Chicago because they thought maybe it was more welcoming for them.AT: 01:16:34 And, um, as far as your own family's experiences go, uh, I mean, it
sounds like your parents were really open or just, you know, forthcoming with information about, um, this particular time. But, um, do you have a, a sense of what that was like for them or their own thoughts or feelings about that move to Chicago?SO: 01:16:59 Uh, I would say that it was tough for them. Uh, I think one, I
think, for climate change. I mean, they were, you know, grew up in, they were used to California weather, so I, Chicago winters can be brutal. Uh, I think that just to get acclimated to the people and the new environment, uh, that they faced prejudice. I'm sure they did. You know, they didn't talk about it. Uh, they yeah, they have the Japanese spirit up, you know, of overcoming it and, and persevering. Uh, and they really wanted the kids to be American. Uh, so, uh, you know, they did everything in their power to make sure we were American. And I think again, that the whole incarceration affected them. They, they didn't want us that, that happened to us. So they wanted us to be very Americanized. So I think that's one lasting legacy for them, was to not teach us Japanese, to, to, you know, make us really American so that hopefully the same thing will happen, won't happen to us. And I would say they've succeeded in that because, uh, I mean, every one of my cousins of my generation, like all, all of my, my dad's brothers, you know, who had kids, my cousins, all of them who married, married, non-Japanese people. So, uh, so I think they really homogenized us into that, into the fabric of the, of the United States.AT: 01:19:13 How do you feel about that legacy? In a way that's been asserting
an American identity.SO: 01:19:26 Uh, well, I, I'm, I'm, I'm torn about that. I mean, part of me
says, yeah, it's great. You know, I mean, you know, I feel, I don't feel Japanese. I mean, I feel American, uh, but the other part of me says, you know, I don't want to lose my heritage either. And, uh, you know, I wish I knew Japanese more. Uh, I wish, um, you know, I keep saying, I want to learn, you know, I'll take a Japanese class and learn more and you know, hopefully I'll do that. Uh, and I keep saying I haven't been to Japan yet either. I mean, I have relatives there that I've never met. Uh, I mean, they don't know me. I don't know them, but it'd be nice to at least see them. Uh, and I keep saying I want to learn Japanese before I go, but if I see if I use that excuse, I'll never go so I should just end up going. Uh, so yeah, I guess, I like, everyone needs to learn their heritage and to respect their heritage and to know enough about it so they can convey it to the next generation. Um, but yeah, I'm also, you know, I'm also glad that I feel American, so, yeah, I guess I wish my mom, dad taught me Japanese when I was growing up, but you know, that I can't blame them, you know.AT: 01:21:05 And if you could, you talk a lot about passing things on to the
next generation or future generations more generally. Uh, if you could leave any kind of message or legacy for the generations to come, what would you want to leave people with?SO: 01:21:34 Uh, let's see.
AT: 01:21:37 And it could be, it could be more specific too. Like if you have
any children.SO: 01:21:41 Yeah, I would say respect, you know, respect your elders. You know,
they have stories to tell. Uh, you can learn from, you know, you can learn from things that have come before the experiences they're experienced. They paved the way for you to live a better life. Uh, so, you know, thank them for that. Oh, the whole incarceration experience. Um, I think has, has made, made my folks stronger and that in turn made me stronger. Um, you know, I feel very, you know, self-reliant. I feel, yeah, I feel I can handle anything that comes at me and I don't know that that's because it's unique to me or whether that was because of what they had gone through. But, you know, respect and not only your relatives and your elders respect history and don't forget history.AT: 01:23:01 Well, thank you so much for opening and speaking with me. Before we
wrap up, is there any last thing you'd like to add or anything that I might've missed?SO: 01:23:11 Well, I don't think so. Let's see. I don't think so. I mean, I
could remember on the South Side in that apartment building. Uh, I remember finally, I mean, you know, people will look back on it now and think we grew up in a slum or something, but when you're growing up in it, you don't think that way. Um, I mean, you know, it was routine to have roaches in the kitchen. I mean, it was routine to not have enough hot water for a bath. You know, you had enough hot water for maybe one bath, so everyone had to, you know, take their turns taking a bath and that same water, uh, I, you know, yeah, I look back on it now and, and I don't think that was bad. I think you know, it was just part of growing up and again, it probably made me stronger for going through all that. Uh, yeah, I had wonderful teachers and not only at Doniatte, but at Bret Harte. Um, you know high school. Uh, so yeah, in Chicago, yeah. I obviously haven't left Chicago except for college, you know, in Champagne-Urbana. I've been here all my life. So, yeah, you know I enjoy the city. I think that there is a lot lot to offer in a city. I don't feel, yeah, I really don't feel prejudiced against me in the city. Um, yeah, I think that has to do with the acclimation and also what Japanese Americans did during the war, especially in my joining the army in the 442nd and 100th and MIS, I think that, you know, really helped the Americans realize that, you know, that these Japanese Americans are American and, and deserve the respect and, uh, the open, you know, openness that you can give them.AT: 01:25:45 Well, thank you so much again for coming in and sharing.
SO: 01:25:49 Oh, you're welcome. I hope it was, you know, worth it, I don't know
if it was. You know, if I was able to answer to much of what you wanted. Okay. You're welcome. Bye now.